Welcome to Ghost of a Podcast. I'm your host, Jessica Lanyadoo. I'm an astrologer, psychic medium, and animal communicator, and I'm going to give you your weekly horoscope and no-bullshit mystical advice for living your very best life.

Jessica:            T, I'm very excited about our reading. What would you like to talk about?

T:                    Yeah. So I am part of basically a goat collective where there's about nine or ten of us who manage responsibilities for a small herd of dairy goats near where I live.

Jessica:            It's just so cute. I'm sorry. It's just so cute.

T:                    It's really fun.

Jessica:            It's really cool.

T:                    There are so many options for people who—you know, having goats on your own is a lot of work, and it's expensive. But if you have like ten people to split vet bills with, it really—it does a lot. You can do a lot.

Jessica:            Amazing.

T:                    So my question was about one of our goats, Gwen. As part of our little dairy operation, we breed our goats every year, usually just one or two. So it's Gwen's first pregnancy, and she's never been the snuggliest goat, but recently, she's just been really—

Jessica:            Is she blonde? Is she kind of a blonde goat?

T:                    We do have a blonde goat, and that's Blue. Gwen is sort of dark in complexion, tan—

Jessica:            We have to talk about Blue in addition to whatever your question is.

T:                    We do.

Jessica:            Okay.

T:                    Yes, we do.

Jessica:            You knew that already.

T:                    I would really like that.

Jessica:            Okay. Okay. Great. Great, great, great.

T:                    Yes.

Jessica:            Okay. So I'm sorry. I didn't mean to cut you off. Keep on talking about Gwen.

T:                    No, that's fine. So it's Gwen's first pregnancy. She's never been super snuggly, but as of late, she's just been really skittish and has not let any of us handle her. And as she progresses further along in her pregnancy, it's really important for us to be able to handle the goats, be able to touch them and feel them and just check up on them so that we can make sure that their pregnancy is going well, especially as they get closer to term. The delivery process is really hands-on.

Jessica:            Oh, wow.

T:                    So I'm just worried about how she's doing, if there's something going on with her, and what we can do to make her comfortable or basically just—yeah, how we can kind of make sure that we're taking care of her in the way we need to take care of her.

Jessica:            I have a weird question.

T:                    Yes.

Jessica:            Did she get pregnant naturally?

T:                    Yes. So what we do is, basically, we take our ladies, and then we have another farmer that we work with, and then we just drop our ladies off with their buck. And they hang out for a few weeks, and when that's all wrapped up, we bring them back home.

Jessica:            Nature. Okay.

T:                    Yes.

Jessica:            Gwen—does she have a hearing issue or a sensitivity with her ears?

T:                    I don't know. Most goats don't like their ears being touched, but as far as I've observed her, I've not noticed any sort of hearing issues.

Jessica:            Okay, because she's immediately showing me discomfort. I'm getting it in this ear, my right ear.

T:                    Okay.

Jessica:            But I'm really bad at right and left when I'm being psychic, so don't trust me on that. It doesn't mean anything. There's something going on in her ear, and it's very uncomfortable for her.

T:                    Oh, really?

Jessica:            I wonder if she has a crystal in her ear. Do goats get crystals in their ears?

T:                    I don't know, but the vet doesn't come out unless there's an emergency, really.

Jessica:            Totally.

T:                    So they haven't had a checkup in a long time. And if she's having discomfort in her ears, I could definitely try and get lights in there and check it out.

Jessica:            Yeah. It might be worth doing. But let me just take a moment and check and check in with her. Say her name, and then also say the names that you call her if you or other people call her something else.

T:                    I do.

Jessica:            Yeah.

T:                    Yes. I call her Gwen, Gwenny-goo, Gwendolyn—mostly those three.

Jessica:            Oh, she's so uncomfortable. She's so uncomfortable. Yeah. So she's not just displaying discomfort with humans. She's displaying discomfort in general, isn't she?

T:                    I mean, she's just not really been super social with the other goats.

Jessica:            Yeah.

T:                    Her mom is part of our herd. Greta is her mom, and they snuggle and they hang out. But other than that, she's just sort of not super interested in what's happening with the other goats.

Jessica:            Okay. So listen. I know very little about goats, so everything I say is not medically founded, is not well researched, okay? I'm just telling you what I'm seeing. Oh, she's having a hard pregnancy. I mean, I don't know why I never thought about whether or not goats could have easy or challenging pregnancies, but she is having a hard pregnancy. She is uncomfortable. The first thing I saw was something bugging her in her ear. It feels like there's something in it.

T:                    Weird. Okay. Okay.

Jessica:            So  I don't know what that could be. And if it happened, it would have happened when she was with the—at the other farm, because she's showing me that it was a very chaotic experience.

T:                    Okay. Yeah.

Jessica:            There was just a lot of noises that she's not used to, and there was action that she's not used to. Was it her first time mating, you said?

T:                    It was. Yeah.

Jessica:            Yeah. She did not like it.

T:                    Well, and the lady told us she was headbutting the buck for really a long time.

Jessica:            She did not want to—she did not like that.

T:                    Do that?

Jessica:            No. No.

T:                    Yeah.

Jessica:            She wants to be a nun.

T:                    Really? Okay.

Jessica:            I mean, I'm not saying, "Oh, she's gay. Oh, she wants to be a nun." But also, she wants to be left to contemplation.

T:                    [crosstalk] pregnancy. Yeah.

Jessica:            She's not interested in bonding, really, in a big way, even. She is a contemplative person.

T:                    Okay.

Jessica:            So I don't know if, before she got pregnant, she was also just a little bit more removed or stoic than the other goats.

T:                    Yeah, I would say she is definitely not our snuggliest goat. She would have her moments where, every now and again, she'd come up for good snugs, long snugs. But mostly, she's kind of independent, doing her own thing.

Jessica:            She's contemplative is what she is.

T:                    I love that.

Jessica:            She's contemplative. And so, if one of you wanted to develop a meditation practice, she would probably come to you if you meditated in her area. She might be like, "Oh, this is a person that I can sit with as they sit." She has that kind of—that's why I said nun. She kind of likes to be left to herself. She's contemplating is really what she's showing me. She's not enjoying the physicality of any part of this process.

T:                    Okay.

Jessica:            And I mean, let me know if you find out anything with her ear. I don't know anything about goat ears.

T:                    Yeah.

Jessica:            But I cannot shake this feeling that there's something in there.

T:                    There's something up with her ear. Okay.

Jessica:            Yeah.

T:                    That's really good to know.

Jessica:            And also, again, if she was bonking heads with this boy, I don't—maybe she just bruised something, and she's still kind of in that, because it was recent, right? It was weeks, or was it months ago?

T:                    Their gestation is four months. So we bred them in, like, February.

Jessica:            Okay. So yeah. It was in the past month or two. So it shouldn't be hurting if it was a bruise. There's something—

T:                    That's really helpful, though. I mean, I feel like if I go up there and it looks like she's in pain a lot, then it's a lot easier to get other members on board for bringing the vet out there, you know?

Jessica:            Yeah.

T:                    It's just a whole thing because there are so many of us involved. But if she's looking in pain and—yeah.

Jessica:            Can you lift her ear and peek?

T:                    I could. Yeah.

Jessica:            She's so annoyed right now. Sorry. Hold on. Are you really tall?

T:                    Me? Well, I feel—my soul is 6'5", but I'm 5'6".

Jessica:            Okay. Okay. That's fair. Are you one of the taller humans that comes around her?

T:                    No, I would say. My mom is 5'10. My sister is 5'11". Other people in the group are like 5'11" also.

Jessica:            Interesting.

T:                    But I would say I'm solidly in the middle.

Jessica:            Okay. You're in the middle, because she's showing me there's one human that smiles a lot, and there's one that's really tall. And I can't tell if she's saying both of those things about you or if she's speaking about two different people.

T:                    I see. Somebody who—I mean, my mom and my sister go up a lot, and they really hang out with the goats, which is awesome.

Jessica:            Does one of them have short hair?

T:                    Not short hair. That might be the goat leader.

Jessica:            You're correct. That is who it is. Okay. So this person, the group leader, might be actually the easiest one to look in her ear.

T:                    Yeah. She's definitely up there the most. Yeah.

Jessica:            Mm-hmm. She also has a little bit of a—she doesn't get nervous as much about hurting Gwen. She feels a little bit like she has some awareness of goat body that is soothing to Gwen. That might be the easiest person to look at her ear because, basically, Gwen is like, "You can do this once. You can do this once." So maybe get her to do it.

T:                    We'll go up together. Yeah.

Jessica:            Yeah. Okay. Good. I love that idea. And then she's just like—when I ask her, "How can you be happy?" she's like, "Just leave—just stop." You know?''

T:                    Yeah. "Let me do my own thing."

Jessica:            She's over it. She's just over it. She's not super comfortable. She's not happy. Something's off. Something's off for her.

T:                    Yeah.

Jessica:            And she's happiest when she can be left alone. So I know you have to handle her when she's giving birth, but she's just like, "I don't even want to think about it. I don't want to think about it."

T:                    Yeah. Yeah.

Jessica:            She just doesn't want to think about it. She's just like, "I'm out."

T:                    Doesn't want to deal.

Jessica:            She's just like, "When it happens, it'll happen, and then I hope it's done." That's basically her attitude.

T:                    Yeah.

Jessica:            This is not a goat who wants to have more children.

T:                    Who wants to breed? Yeah. I guess that was sort of like—honestly, when I was contemplating this reading, it was like, God, I'm almost even afraid to ask you if this is what they want because of the implications.

Jessica:            Yeah.

T:                    And I feel like I love my animals. I want to do right by them. And it's taken me a long time to understand their personhood and center that.

Jessica:            Yeah.

T:                    And our goat group is going through a lot of changes right now. A lot of people are having babies and going to grad school. And so we're like [crosstalk]—

Jessica:            Humans are, not goats are.

T:                    The humans are. Yeah.

Jessica:            Yes. Okay, okay, okay.

T:                    Goats are not going to grad school.

Jessica:            Yeah. No, they're not.

T:                    The humans are going to grad school and having babies. And we're kind of just in a moment where we're kind of restructuring and redefining, and I guess I kind of just more broadly want to know—all these changes are happening. I'm like, I want to ask, what do they want? What do they like about their lives? What—

Jessica:            I can tell you—

T:                    I know some of the goats probably are happy being moms. They're good moms, you know?

Jessica:            Yeah.

T:                    But—

Jessica:            Gwen doesn't want to.

T:                    —not all of our goats are breeding.

Jessica:            Yeah. Gwen doesn't want to breed—

T:                    Yeah. She doesn't want to.

Jessica:            —at all.

T:                    Yeah.

Jessica:            I don't know what Blue wanted—okay. So Gwen's mom likes being a mom.

T:                    Yeah, let's talk about Blue.

Jessica:            Gwen's mom likes being a mom. So I can tell you that because I'm just looking at them both right now.

T:                    Yeah.

Jessica:            So who is—Blue is the blonde.

T:                    The beige goat. Yeah.

Jessica:            Okay. Yeah.

T:                    She's the brown goat.

Jessica:            And is she kind of—I know she's the cool girl. I don't know if she's kind of like a ringleader. She's kind of like a strong personality.

T:                    She's a strong personality, to say. I would describe her as a very jealous goat. She really loves attention. She loves scratches. She's the one who is like, "Hello. I'm here. We're here. You're paying attention to me. We're snuggling now."

Jessica:            Yes. I respect a Leo. I love a Leo.

T:                    Yeah.

Jessica:            Okay. Okay. So I don't actually believe in applying astrology to animals, but you just described it, so I had to lean in.

T:                    Yeah. That's who she is, so yeah.

Jessica:            Totally. Totally. And does she have babies or is she pregnant?

T:                    We have decided not to move forward with breeding her because she's had three pregnancies, and two of them were really complicated.

Jessica:            Yeah.

T:                    And her last pregnancy basically just went really bad, and we lost her babies last year. It was really hard—

Jessica:            Oh, I'm so sorry.

T:      —and really sad.

Jessica:      Okay. I'm really glad that you've come to that decision.

T:      Yeah.

Jessica:            She is—I mean, oh my God. You could just take her on tours. You could bring her around kids.

T:                    She's a star. Yeah.

Jessica:            She's so wonderful. That makes sense why, as soon as I start talking to Gwen, she's like, "But, girl, did you see me?"

T:                    She butts in. She literally does that. You will be cuddling a goat 50 yards away, and she's like—

Jessica:            Galloping to you.

T:                    —"No, but me." Exactly.

Jessica:            Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

T:                    And she shoves everybody else out of the way.

Jessica:            I see that. I see that.

T:                    She's such a goat, honestly, in a way.

Jessica:            I see that. I mean, she just tried to shove Gwen away—

T:                    Yes.

Jessica:            —as soon as I came on scene. So she actually has—she's really happy. She's a really happy goat.

T:                    Great.

Jessica:            So there's nothing she needs except for—

T:                    Attention.

Jessica:            —acknowledgement and attention. Exactly. Who else is in the herd?

T:                    Yeah, so Gwen's mom, Greta, is our eldest goat.

Jessica:            She's great.

T:                    She's our grandma.

Jessica:            Yeah.

T:                    She is nine years old, and she's retired from breeding.

Jessica:            Yes.

T:                    And she just gets to babysit grandkids all day, which I think she's just—

Jessica:            She's so good.

T:                    Yeah.

Jessica:            She's so happy. She's such a happy goat.

T:                    She's a really great goat. She's like a snuggle bug.

Jessica:            Yeah, and she's had a good life.

T:                    Yeah.

Jessica:            She's pleased with her life.

T:                    That makes me really—that warms my heart to hear.

Jessica:            Yeah. She feels she's had a good life. Early period wasn't as good, but she's had a good life. So that's lovely.

T:                    Yeah. Our other goats—our herd leader is Ophelia. She's large and in charge, and yeah.

Jessica:            And Ophelia is still breeding?

T:                    Yes.

Jessica:            Yeah.

T:                    She's the other goat who's pregnant this year.

Jessica:            I was about to say she's showing me her belly. It's interesting because Gwen does not feel very pregnant to me. Gwen feels very uncomfortable to me, whereas this goat is like, "I am a pregnant person with 100 million babies." She's just very pregnant.

T:                    Yeah. Yes.

Jessica:            This is very interesting because I've never talked to goats who were pregnant before.  I don't know how much they—I think it looks very uncomfortable. They both seem—

T:                    Pregnancy generally is uncomfortable.

Jessica:            Is uncomfortable. Yeah. She seems a little uncomfortable, but she is overall really good at communicating her needs. She's not super needy, and she's not like our Leo queen about it, but she's good at being like, "I need to be alone now. I need to be snuggling now. I need to be eating now. I need to be"—

T:                    Mm-hmm.

Jessica:            She's really good at communicating her needs. Are goats like horses, where you have to deal with their shoes?

T:                    You have to take care of their hooves, yeah, regularly.

Jessica:            Okay, because I feel like I don't know if she had a hoof issue or if she has a hoof issue. It doesn't look like an emergency 9-1-1, but there's something—

T:                    We need to check out her feet?

Jessica:            —that feels like a—it's like—again, I can't tell if it's a past injury and it's just mild now, so it's maybe something she's been living with a long time, or if it's the beginning of something, I can't tell.

T:                    I see.

Jessica:            But it's like there's a little something there with her hoof. And I can't tell what side it's on, but I'm getting this on the right again. But I don't have any confidence that I'm correct about that. So just look at both sides.

T:                    Yeah. Looking at both of her feet.

Jessica:            And anything that would impact her hand would also impact her foot. Do you know what I'm saying?

T:                    Yes. Yeah.

Jessica:            Okay. But she's very good. Who else have we got?

T:                    That's great to hear. And then our youngest goat right now is Olivia. She's the baby of the group. She was one of our babies last year. And she's just being a baby. We don't breed them until they're two or three.

Jessica:            That's great.

T:                    So she's chilling.

Jessica:            She's chilling, and also, I think she'll probably be good with being a mom.

T:                    Yeah.

Jessica:            She has that kind of personality.

T:                    She's a [crosstalk] girl.

Jessica:            Yeah, yeah, yeah. She feels really open and easy. I don't know that Gwen's ever been open and easy, exactly.

T:                    Yeah.

Jessica:            And so it's not stunning that she's not enjoying this.

T:                    Yeah.

Jessica:            Do you have a cat, or is there a cat on the land?

T:                    Yeah. So we have feral cats who live in the barn, and we feed and take care of them as well.

Jessica:            Is there one in particular that spends time with the goats?

T:                    I don't know. They're very people shy.

Jessica:            That makes sense.

T:                    And I only go in the morning. So, sometimes, the people who come in the evening will see them, but I—

Jessica:            Is there an orange cat? Am I seeing an orange cat there?

T:                    I actually have never seen them. I know there's a gray-and-black one, and one might be orange. But I actually have never even laid eyes on them.

Jessica:            Okay. Okay. Who is it that I'm talking to? It's not Ophelia. It's the one that's under Ophelia, the younger one from a few—

T:                    Olivia.

Jessica:            Olivia. Thank you. Sorry. They don't resonate with their names, so it's hard for me to track them through names. She really has a thing for this one cat. She just keeps on showing me this cat.

T:                    [crosstalk].

Jessica:            Yeah. So I don't know if she's just charmed by them and watches them or if she has a dynamic with one. But she's showing me the cats, and there's nothing else associated with it. I'll tell you what. There's something about Gwen, who you wrote me about, who—I know this sounds silly, but—

T:                    No, tell me.

Jessica:            —have you ever read to her?

T:                    I haven't.

Jessica:            Have you thought about it?

T:                    I mean, I talk to them.

Jessica:            Yeah.

T:                    I talk to them a lot. I talk out loud to them, and sometimes we'll listen to the radio together while we're doing chores. But yeah, I mean, a lot of my curiosity for this reading was like, if there are some of my goats who don't want to be pregnant or the goats who can't be pregnant anymore, like Blue and Greta, what would they like? You know, are there other jobs they would like, other activities they would like?

Jessica:            Oh. Interesting. Blue would like to do tours.

T:                    She wants to go on tour?

Jessica:            She would like to do tours. She could do parties. She could do educational tours. I think she would enjoy birthday parties.

T:                    Oh my God. Yeah.

Jessica:            She would really like all of those things.

T:                    Yeah. Yeah.

Jessica:            And  I don't know how she knows these things exist, but she's telling me this. So I wonder, has she ever done anything like that before?

T:                    It's been a long time since we've taken them out, but occasionally, we'll load them up and we'll bring them to breweries to fundraise for our group—

Jessica:            Totally.

T:                    —or we'll take them on the promenade, and they can just kind of sit on the grassy hill. They just get to go on adventures sometimes.

Jessica:            Yeah. She loves it.

T:                    But we haven't done that in a long time.

Jessica:            She loves it. She would love—

T:                    She loves that? That's great.

Jessica:            Yeah. And she could actually be a revenue stream in that way—

T:                    Okay.

Jessica:            —as long as one of you went and were there as her human protector.

T:                    Of course.

Jessica:            And then the other one is who again?

T:                    Greta, so Blue's mom—

Jessica:            So Greta would like—

T:                    —and Gwen's mom. Yeah.

Jessica:            Greta would like to do what she's doing.

T:                    Yeah. She's just being grandma.

Jessica:            She's just like—she has a home. She's around friends and family. She's chill. So, if you guys can afford to keep her where she is, keep her where she is, doing what she does, Blue is the only one who's like, "Take me on a promenade." Everybody else is not having that instinct. Gwen would like to never have babies again.

T:                    You know what? Yeah.

Jessica:            Yeah. Never meet with a boy goat again. I think she would like to be read to. I think she would like to be a meditation companion.

T:                    Really?

Jessica:            Yeah, to sit. She likes to sit. And it's not that she doesn't like people. She actually does like people.

T:                    Yeah.

Jessica:            But she likes calm and still people. And so, if you're coming and you're like, "Okay, I'm going to feed you. I'm going to check in with you. I'm going to make sure everything's good," it's a little overstimulating for her.

T:                    Yeah.

Jessica:            So she might check in, but she'll mainly try to watch from a distance. I don't think she prefers men in general. I think she might have had some uncomfortable experiences with men. So the farm that you just dropped her at—was the guy wearing a big hat?

T:                    I actually wasn't there, so—

Jessica:            You weren't there. Okay.

T:                    —I don't know. Yeah.

Jessica:            Okay. She's showing me a man in a big hat that she just didn't like, she just didn't like. She didn't like the vibes. She didn't like the energy. She didn't like the handling. She is a real individualist. Of all the goats, she has the strongest need for her personhood to be seen, which is ironic because you'd think that Blue would be the one. But Blue just wants to be seen as fucking fabulous—

T:                    Yeah. She just wants compliments. Yeah.

Jessica:            —as opposed to, "See my personhood," right?

T:                    Okay.

Jessica:            Whereas this Gwen goat is—you know the Golden Girls?

T:                    Yes.

Jessica:            Okay. You know the tallest one? Why am I blanking on her name? Bea Arthur is the actress's name.

T:                    Yeah, yeah, yeah. I don't know either, but I—yes. I know what you're putting down. Yep.

Jessica:            She would be that. She's just kind of like the smart one, the contemplative one. She's not the busiest one.

T:                    Okay. That makes sense to me.

Jessica:            Of course, Rose, Betty White, would be Blue.

T:                    Yes.

Jessica:            Okay. Good. Just so we're clear. Just so we're clear.

T:                    Yes.

Jessica:            So all of this to say it looks like you and your mom and your sibling are pretty committed to sticking this out and caring for these goats.

T:                    Yeah. Mm-hmm.

Jessica:            It does look like your group may be cut in half.

T:                    Yeah. That is literally—yeah.

Jessica:            Literally, yeah, that's what it looks like. And I honestly think Blue could supplement your income. Just Blue alone could supplement your income—

T:                    Cool.

Jessica:            —if you all figure out a way to do parties with her.

T:                    Yeah.

Jessica:            She does like a little bit of clothing but not a lot of clothing. So you could give her ribbons or something fabulous, as long as it wasn't in any way tight on her neck.

T:                    Okay.

Jessica:            But if she knew that she was being adorned, she would love it.

T:                    That is great to hear.

Jessica:            Yeah.

T:                    I love that, and that makes total sense [crosstalk].

Jessica:            None of the other goats want clothes, by the way. None of them. None of them. None of them.

T:                    No.

Jessica:            But Blue is just super interested in having something that shows everyone how special she is.

T:                    Yes. That really tracks for her.

Jessica:            Yeah. She's pretty remarkable.

T:                    Can I ask a question about Gwen?

Jessica:            Yeah. Please.

T:                    So a couple things are coming up for me when I'm hearing this. One, the reason that we're breeding the goats at all is for milk, which means that she's going to get milked twice a day, which might be really hard for her. And I'm wondering what—

Jessica:            Okay.

T:                    Yeah.

Jessica:            This is what I can see. So, first of all, definitely, you want to check out her ear in case that I am seeing something.

T:                    Yeah. Right, in case she's in pain and that's making it harder for her to just be there.

Jessica:            Totally. Yeah.

T:                    Yeah.

Jessica:            The other thing is, when dealing with livestock, it is very common and reasonable to be like, "Okay. We're going to go do this, and then we're going to do it, and you be efficient and you get it done as quick as possible."

T:                    Right. Yeah. Yeah.

Jessica:            But if you went to—I don't know—the gynecologist and they did that with you—

T:                    Right. Oh my God.

Jessica:            —it would be much more upsetting.

T:                    Yeah.

Jessica:            So, instead, with her—and honestly with all the other goats that I've met—you could do that, and they would not be upset. Some of them might like it a little less than others, but they wouldn't be in any way upset. Gwen is different. It's more like hang out. Give it five full minutes just being silent, being present, if you can, just hanging out, letting her sniff you, even if it's from a great distance, and then moving closer towards her and giving it another five minutes. But it may be two minutes on the second move. It has to be something you can sustain so that she understands that there is a process and that you are relating to her as a person.

T:                    Yeah. Yes.

Jessica:            Again, she's got very strong needs around her personhood. And so it's really like being rushed gets the worst out of her, always, right?

T:                    Yeah.

Jessica:            You've seen this already.

T:                    Yeah, when she's being treated like a chore.

Jessica:            Yeah.

T:                    Yeah.

Jessica:            Or like livestock. She's a person.

T:                    Yeah. Yeah.

Jessica:            She's not just a person. She's a spiritually reflective person. So she's contemplating the world. She's considering things.

T:                    [crosstalk]. Yeah.

Jessica:            And so being treated without consideration agitates her, and it makes her feel trapped. And so she goes into a survival mechanism behavior, right?

T:                    Yeah. Yeah, that totally makes sense.

Jessica:            And she has a couple of them. So she flip-flops on which ones. But she has a couple. So I would just move slowly towards—

T:                    Slowly.

Jessica:            —the action and be consistent with the way you move towards the action. And verbalize—so the way you communicate with animals is through pictures. So visualize her standing there being totally safe, totally comfortable, you doing whatever milking is, it lasting—show her through sunlight how many minutes, how many hours it'll take. And then show her a picture of her walking away completely unharmed, going back to her life afterwards.

T:                    Great.

Jessica:            So show her the three or four stages of this. Visualize it, maybe when you're standing there. And if she's like, "No, bitch," she'll let you know, and then you'll have to cross that bridge, right?

T:                    Yeah. Right. Yeah.

Jessica:            But communicating with her is a really big deal. So, if we come back to the metaphor of how a doctor treats you, if you go to the dentist and they just tell you to open your mouth and they just go at it—

T:                    Get in your shit. Yeah.

Jessica:            —it's very upsetting.

T:                    It's abrupt. Yeah.

Jessica:            It's more helpful when they tell you, "Okay, I'm going to use a drill-sounding thing, but it's not a drill. Don't worry." Right?

T:                    Yeah.

Jessica:            You want to get a heads-up. So she needs a heads-up.

T:                    Okay.

Jessica:            And she's really interesting because she's very receptive to animal communication. She's very receptive to—

T:                    I was going to ask that. Yeah.

Jessica:            Yeah. But the problem is she's so stressed by you humans that she's just like, "I don't know. I don't know. I don't know." The second I was in the vicinity, Blue was like, "Bitch, I'm here. Why are you looking over there? I'm here."

T:                    Yeah.

Jessica:            But this goat it was hard for me to hook in right away because—I mean, not that hard, but she wasn't as available because she's turned away from humans because she hasn't had the best experiences. She's not abused. It's just—

T:                    She doesn't want to be part of the system.

Jessica:            That's a really good way of putting it. Yes. She doesn't.

T:                    You know? She doesn't want to do this. Yeah.

Jessica:            No. She's not livestock.

T:                    Yeah. Yeah.

Jessica:            She's a goat. She's a person who's a goat. She's never been milked before, right?

T:                    No.

Jessica:            But she's seen it?

T:                    Yes.

Jessica:            Okay. Does it hurt?

T:                    No. I mean, it should bring relief, like—

Jessica:            Okay. Okay.

T:                    —when the bag gets really full, that's when it gets really tender. So it's on us to make sure that we're milking her at a time in a way so that her bag doesn't get so full that it becomes painful.

Jessica:            Okay. Let me just show her that.

T:                    But generally, the milking brings relief from the discomfort in the bag.

Jessica:            She needs to be treated really gently.

T:                    Yeah.

Jessica:            She's got a really sensitive body.

T:                    Yeah.

Jessica:            So I'm just showing her that it will bring relief because she hasn't been—she's seen this, and she's just been like, "I don't know if that hurts or not."

T:                    Yeah.

Jessica:            She just doesn't know if it hurts or not. So I'm showing her that it will bring a lightening and a relief.

T:                    Yeah. Yeah. Mm-hmm.

Jessica:            And she's a little bit more relaxed at this idea. I've told her that I've communicated to you to be gentle because she's sensitive, because she's telling me she's sensitive. I've also let her know that I haven't told the other humans that, because I don't want to assure her of something that's not true, right?

T:                    Yeah.

Jessica:            So you can communicate that to the other humans to the best of your ability, that she just needs real kid gloves—pardon the pun.

T:                    Yeah.

Jessica:            And she's not going to be like, "Okay, cool. Now I'm Blue." Right?

T:                    Now I'm all good. Yeah.

Jessica:            She's not going to just be, like, chill.

T:                    A different goat? Yeah.

Jessica:            But she understands a little bit more, which is good. And she can't promise you how she's going to behave because she's never experienced it before.

T:                    Right. Of course.

Jessica:            And she can't tell if it hurts.

T:                    Yeah.

Jessica:            She hasn't been shown that it hurts, but she has been shown that none of the goats would do this of their own choosing. And so she's just not sure. You know what I mean?

T:                    Right. Yeah.

Jessica:            Every one of the other goats have been made to go into this place where they get milked.

T:                    Yeah. I mean, you give them grain, and—but they do have to be trained. And it takes really a fair amount of training.

Jessica:            She has a different way of framing that, but yes. Yeah.

T:                    Fair enough. Yeah.

Jessica:            She's like, "Eventually they all do it because they have to," is her attitude.

T:                    Yeah. That's true. Yeah. That's true.

Jessica:            Yeah. And so she's just not sure how much pain is associated with it. And she just really doesn't like pain, which is interesting. I've not been told by an animal, "I don't like pain." But she really just does not like pain at all.

T:                    That's good to know.

Jessica:            Yes. Yeah. She's sensey, baby.

T:                    Yeah. I hear everything you're saying. And I definitely feel confident in my ability to advocate for her, especially—I can share this reading with people. I feel like people in my group are generally woo enough to bite—

Jessica:            Great. Great.

T:                    —and at least be respectful or have it turn on their eyes a little bit more, you know.

Jessica:            Totally. Yes.

T:                    I guess my question is—I'm like a junior witch. Would she be interested in working together to do more communication, like training me, basically?

Jessica:            Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Totally. Okay. So my guide's just reminding me to tell you something that I haven't told you. Okay. This is the thing. This is the thing about goats and pigs and so many other animals. I talk to you. You just heard me, right?

T:                    Yeah.

Jessica:            You heard me?

T:                    Yes.

Jessica:            And your mind was like, "Okay." You know, some humans would take a little—like several seconds to respond, to process what I said. If we were hanging out in the same space and I was like, "Hey, come over here," and you heard me, you might get up and come over here, or you might think, "No, I'm not going to come over there." But you would be interactive immediately.

                        Goats are not the same as humans in this way. So, if she is sitting and contemplating sunlight as she loves to do, and a human comes by and is like, "Come over here for snuggles," she might kind of be aware that you said, "Come over here for snuggles," and that that sounds like a pleasant activity. But for now, she's contemplating sunlight.

                        And these are not competing desires like it would be to you or to me as humans. For her, for goats in general—and I found this with pigs as well—she's just really like, "Just because I didn't come to snuggle you now doesn't mean I am saying no to snuggling you. It means I'm right now contemplating sunlight," or maybe it's like, "Right now I'm eating," or, "Right now I'm"—you know? Whatever it is.

                        And so there's something, if you're going to practice communicating with her, to understand, which is time is spacious for her because she's a different animal than you are. And so you might, say, hang out and visualize her coming over and getting a little scootchy on her nose and then walking away. Show her the picture. It might take her 20 minutes to come over for the scratch.

T:      Ten minutes. Yeah.

Jessica:            You know, depending on what she's doing, depending on her personality, depending on her trust level.

T:                    Yeah.

Jessica:            And so it's not her saying no if she doesn't respond swiftly because she's not a human.

T:                    Yeah.

Jessica:            We're trained to be as quick and interactive as we are. And also, maybe it's our nature. But with goats, and certainly with this goat, she—

T:                    Yeah. That's not—she needs space and time, and she needs, like, a buffer.

Jessica:            It's space. It's not time to her. It's space. It's just—

T:                    I see.

Jessica:            When you're animal communicating, don't think of the time; think of the space. And so be less concerned with having validation of communication and more concerned with receiving and being open because the thing is I am able to communicate with these goats because I am receiving energetically. And I don't really know how to describe that other than that. And they're able to share with me not just because they are sharing with me, but because they're willing to receive my presence. Right?

T:                    Yeah.

Jessica:            So communication is so much about receptivity with animals. And it's visual, and it's emotional. It's hard to tap into her emotions because she doesn't want you to feel her feelings, because she's more of a nun than all that.

T:                    Yeah. Yeah.

Jessica:            She's a little buttoned up.

T:                    So more austere. Yeah.

Jessica:            Yeah, yeah, yeah.

T:                    We go grazing for many hours at a time, so I feel like that might be a nice time to practice, is just when we're sitting and in the sun and just they're doing their thing, and we can take our time with it.

Jessica:            If you can sit, it'll be easier for her to communicate with you.

T:                    Okay.

Jessica:            Yeah.

T:                    That's helpful.

Jessica:            It has been easier for her to communicate with me because I haven't been physically present, because then I don't pose any physical threat to her. She is concerned for her physical welfare a great deal for a goat.

T:                    Yeah.

Jessica:            Did you have her since she was born?

T:                    Yeah. Mm-hmm. Yeah. She is Greta's baby.

Jessica:            Oh, that's right. You said. Yeah. She's just very, very sensitive. She doesn't like being hurt.

T:                    Yeah.

Jessica:            So, anyways, all of this to say I think that grazing time is your best time for that.

T:                    Great.

Jessica:            Yeah, yeah, yeah. And I think, when practicing animal communication, it's always really helpful to start with super small things, like, "Come over here, and you get this cookie." You know?

T:                    Mm-hmm.

Jessica:            And if the practice goes well, then you can visualize her coming a weird route.

T:                    Okay. Yeah.

Jessica:            Yeah. That's a nice way to get clarity because, otherwise, you're like, "Well, I have the cookie. You should just come for the damn cookie." Right?

T:                    [crosstalk].

Jessica:            So, instead of visualizing her coming—like if she's across from you, coming straight for you, show her a picture of her walking in a semicircle to you to get the cookie.

T:                    Okay. Mm-hmm.

Jessica:            And if she does that, it's not just about her hearing you. It's about her wanting to communicate to you that she's heard you.

T:                    Yeah. Yeah. Right.

Jessica:            So you want to receive it that way, right? It's not about orders. It's about respect and collaboration.

T:                    Collaboration. Yeah.

Jessica:            Correct, correct, correct, correct. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

T:                    Okay.

Jessica:            Yeah.

T:                    That makes a lot of sense.

Jessica:            Good.

T:                    That feels really helpful. Thank you.

Jessica:            Good. I'm so glad. I'm so glad. Is there anything else you want to know about these goat babies?

T:                    About these goat babies?

Jessica:            Or adults. Goat people, I meant.

T:                    Goat people. Yeah. I think I'm definitely sort of developing into my woo sense. I'm wondering, are any of them interested in doing spiritual work? It seems like Gwen is maybe interested in that.

Jessica:            Her.

T:                    Like grief work, other things like that, or is it—Blue just really just is like a star and she just wants attention.

Jessica:            Blue wants to party. Blue wants to party, okay? Blue, honestly, I think would love to be around kids who just adore her.

T:                    Okay.

Jessica:            Children. Human children. I think that would make her so happy. Yeah. She would like children. She must have met children before because she's very clear about this. So, in terms of grief work, it's interesting because I actually just did a reading over on my Patreon about donkeys doing grief work. So it's funny. It's cool that all these goats and donkeys doing grief work. I think Gwen and her mom could both get into it, but you would need to kind of get a little further with your relationship with Gwen—

T:                    With Gwen. Yeah. That makes sense.

Jessica:            —to make that work.

T:                    Yeah. I can prioritize that.

Jessica:            And Greta on her own—it wouldn't be sustainable to just have one goat do it.

T:                    Yeah. It's a lot of work.

Jessica:            What you're visualizing, I'm seeing, takes more than—it would be more like a group effort.

T:                    Yeah.

Jessica:            And it's hard to say Ophelia, right? The pregnant one? Is that her name, Ophelia?

T:                    Yes. Mm-hmm.

Jessica:            So she's so focused on her pregnancy right now, it's a little hard to say what she'll be like afterwards. But she's kind of like an ideal candidate for having babies.

T:                    And she's great. I mean, she knows her job. She keeps everybody safe. She's just big, and she gets the job done, and she headbutts every dog and gets rid of every threat. She just is so focused.

Jessica:            And she's physically comfortable being pregnant.

T:                    Yeah.

Jessica:            Pregnancy is uncomfortable in general, but she's like, "Oh, yeah, I know what my body is doing. This is great"—

T:                    Yeah. She's built for it. Yeah.

Jessica:            —whereas, I mean, fucking—

T:                    She just was not into it.

Jessica:            I mean, she could be a lesbian separatist. You know what I mean? She's really like—this is not her favorite life experience.

T:                    That's good to know.

Jessica:            Yeah. Yeah.

T:                    I mean, honestly, and I relate to her so much for that.

Jessica:            Yeah. Yeah. Respect.

T:                    So maybe we'll have time to bond with each other and relate to each other over that.

Jessica:            I think you have a lot in common with her. So yeah. I'm trying to see if there's—is there any other questions you have for me about the goats?

T:                    About the goats? Yeah. I mean, so we're thinking about onboarding more people. What kind of people do they like?

Jessica:            Well, it really does depend, because they're all really different from each other. Honestly, Ophelia and Greta are—you're not going to make a bad choice for them. They're fine. Blue—same.

T:                    Great.

Jessica:            You're not going to make a bad choice for her. She's fine. She's such a different kind of person, but she's chill. The only one who's special needs is Gwen.

T:                    Yeah. Good to know.

Jessica:            And she needs calm. She needs patience. She's showing me a fear of a specific kind of—

T:                    A specific—yeah.

Jessica:            —like a rancher or a farmer man.

T:                    Yeah. Yeah.

Jessica:            You know that archetype of—I don't know where she's encountered this, but she has a fear of being wrangled, and—

T:                    Yeah. Corralled and—yeah.

Jessica:            —she wants to be connected with.

T:                    Yeah.

Jessica:            So she's the one that needs extra care. I mean, you could take Blue home with you and she could live with your roommates.

T:                    She could sleep in my bed.

Jessica:            Yeah. Totally. She's chill. She's like, "Whatever. You want to go to the bar? We can go to the bar. I don't care."

T:                    Yeah.

Jessica:            She's chill. Yeah. So I don't think you need to be too worried about that much. I do think that there is—if you're going to be reconfiguring the group, maybe with the five that are remaining, just kind of connecting. Maybe you do a Zoom if you can't all be in the same place at the same time—

T:                    Yeah. Totally.

Jessica:            —where you talk about, "Okay, so what are the things that are really working? What are the things that we want to work on? How do we want to communicate who the goats are and what care needs they have?" because in the way that you communicate about the goats, you're going to alienate some people and really attract others.

T:                    Right. Yeah. It's true.

Jessica:            And that'll just do it, right?

T:                    Yeah.

Jessica:            Because if you come in with, "We have a really sensitive goat who needs extra care," some people will be like, "No, thank you." Great. Let's get rid of those people. Those are not your people. Do you know what I mean? So that's what I would say to that. The land you're on is great for the goats.

T:                    Yeah. It's really beautiful. We're really lucky.

Jessica:            All of the goats—yeah. All of the goats love the land. Yeah. Do you have any other questions?

T:                    About the goats, not so much. I had, really, a Saturn Return experience, and I'm on the other side of that. And one of the things I have learned is that my body is really expensive, and I have really a hard time with money. I just need a side hustle. And I have a bunch of little bullshit things that I do, and it would be really helpful for me if you could pull some cards about what might be a good place for me to start because I just feel really scattered and kind of dispersed.

Jessica:            I'm going to do you one better. I'm going to do you one better, okay? Hold on. Hold on for a second.

T:                    Yeah. Do me one better.

Jessica:            Yeah. I'm going to do you one better. We are now looking at your birth chart. You were born in March 1996 in LA, California, at 8:52 a.m. local time. And we're not sharing the exact day because not everyone needs to know everything. So this is me doing you one better. You have Venus in Taurus in the twelfth house, and it's trine to Jupiter. Man, you like to spend money. Man, you like things.

T:                    I do.

Jessica:            You like food. You like experiences.

T:                    I do like food.

Jessica:            And you spend money on them.

T:                    I do.

Jessica:            And every time you spend money, you're like, "It's just $5 here. It's not a big deal. It's just $50 there. It's not a big deal." And it just goes quick, right?

T:                    Yeah. I mean, I just spend money, honestly, on a lot of art supplies and food. I don't go out to restaurants anymore because I have autoimmune issues, so I physically can't go to restaurants. But I buy expensive groceries and I make expensive food at home.

Jessica:            And you buy expensive, beautiful, high-quality artisanal tools to make art.

T:                    I do.

Jessica:            And when you buy clothes, they're beautiful clothes and they're ethically sourced.

T:                    They are.

Jessica:            Yeah, I see you. I see your chart. So the question is not the side hustle.

T:                    Okay.

Jessica:            It might be the side hustle, to be clear.

T:                    Yeah.

Jessica:            And honestly, I think Blue could be your side hustle. But I actually think it's your spending that is not proportionate because you have this beautiful Venus in Taurus in the twelfth house, and it's trine to your beautiful Jupiter in Cancer in the eighth house. And that can be like a money pit because, in the moment, you always feel like, "It's an investment in myself, man."

T:                    Yeah.

Jessica:            "It's a growth experience, man." And so you can kind of just not notice how quickly you spend large sums.

T:                    Yeah.

Jessica:            And this aspect of your birth chart will not go away regardless of how much money you make.

T:                    Yeah.

Jessica:            So you can make $50 more, $500 more, $50,000 more, and you're still going to have that impulse to be like, "But I can just get nicer cheeses and better butter," and such and thus, right?

T:                    Yeah. Yeah.

Jessica:            Again, I can't help it because I've met Blue: Blue would like to be taken on tour.

T:                    Yeah. She wants to be a show pony. Yeah.

Jessica:            She wants to be a show pony. So let her have her day in the sun—

T:                    Let her be a show pony. Yeah.

Jessica:            —because then you make more money with the group, and I don't know if you're the one who maybe does the show-ponying. Maybe then you get paid extra or something. But I actually wonder if the best advice I can give you is to budget. I'm sorry. I know.

T:                    I really struggle with it.

Jessica:            I know.

T:                    It's like I feel like I struggle to have boundaries with myself around it.

Jessica:            Correct. Correct. Yes.

T:                    The internal boundaries are really hard.

Jessica:            Yeah. You have a stellium in Pisces, and it involves Mars and Saturn. And so, for you, life is hard. Life is difficult. Everything is moving. It's moving away from you. Why does the ocean keep on pulling away from you? And then you're like, "But this beautiful, artisanal salad made by a farmer—that's right here. And I can support the farmer and support my body, so why wouldn't I do that?" Right?

T:                    Right, like, "Everything is so hard. I should eat this cheese."

Jessica:            Yes. Yes, because it's material. It's like a material thing. And so, unfortunately, the best advice I can give you is to budget. And you might need to look into resources—hopefully free, but maybe not—but resources that support you in identifying abundancy-focused budgeting strategies.

T:                    Okay.

Jessica:            So that might mean recognizing that, yes, all of the expensive cheeses are worth it, and one expensive cheese is possible this week. Which one expensive cheese will you choose? Do you know what I'm saying?

T:                    Yeah.

Jessica:            And so it's interesting because it is a great joy for you to spend money the way you spend it on the things you spend it on.

T:                    Yeah.

Jessica:            And there's something that happens when I said, "Okay. Don't buy all the cheeses. Buy one cheese," where your system just kind of really reacted. Do you know what I'm talking about?

T:                    Yeah. I felt, like, flat.

Jessica:            Yes. I saw that. I saw that. And you left your body really quickly because it feels like a punishment to you.

T:                    Yeah.

Jessica:            Budgeting or working within a structure feels like a punishment because Jupiter is like, "I should have everything all at once. That's what growth is." And so there's a way to reframe it as, "I do get all the most delicious artisanal cheeses, but I don't get them all today. Which one is the most delightful?" or, "Which farmer do I most want to support?" Or, or, or. You know what I mean?

T:                    Yeah.

Jessica:            It's about reframing because I actually don't think more labor is the answer to your health and your needs.

T:                    Yeah.

Jessica:            I think it's more conscientious spending to support you being in a home that feels safe and beautiful.

T:                    Yeah.

Jessica:            I'm sorry.

T:                    I feel like it's like I don't even really know where the money goes. I have no idea.

Jessica:            Yes. Yes, I see that.

T:                    I don't consciously spend a lot of money on food. I feel like I spend a normal amount, and then it's just slipping through my fingers. I don't even know what happens to it.

Jessica:            I get it. I get it. And so you might want to manually input everything you spend your money on. So you have to be like, "Okay. So cheese, $7,000," or whatever.

T:                    Please help me fix my budget. $7,000 cheese.

Jessica:            Yeah. You could also use the notes app of your phone, and every time you spend money, just write it down.

T:                    Yeah.

Jessica:            I think you will find—and this is not general advice for all the people. I'm looking at your chart, okay?

T:                    Yeah.

Jessica:            And I think you will find that what feels like not spending a lot of money on a particular indulgence actually is a place that you could change your life.

T:                    Whoa. Yeah.

Jessica:            Sorry. Yeah. And listen. There's nothing wrong with having very expensive tastes. I love it that you have expensive tastes because it's not about capitalism when I say that; it's about quality. It's about hedonism. It's about materialism, not capitalism—materialism. There's nothing wrong with loving things and the function that they give, whether it's giving you the tools to create art or food that feels nourishing and life-affirming. This is not bad, but it's about figuring out, where is the space between not enough and too much? Right?

T:                    Yeah.

Jessica:            Where is the line? It moves based on how much money you're making, the needs of your system, the needs of whatever. Right? Figuring out how to think about this not as a punishment but instead as working within your means so that you can have all the things you want, because right now, what's happening is you're having all the things you want, and then the consequences are bad.

T:                    Yeah. That's what it is.

Jessica:            Yeah.

T:                    I mean, it's like studio fees and all this just amorphous stuff. And then I'm like, "Fuck it. I don't have enough money for my bullshit supplements that I need to keep my body running." And then I'm also getting all the supplements and also doing all the medication. And it's like the medication itself is just so expensive.

Jessica:            So expensive.

T:                    And it just feels bad because it's like I feel so limited already, and then it just feels like I have to get rid of everything that I love about my life, you know?

Jessica:            Yep.

T:                    And then to do what? To buy more vitamins. But yeah, that is just actually what needs to happen in a grown-up way.

Jessica:            And it's what needs to happen in this moment because if you were less stressed—let's say you decided, "Okay. I'm going to take this budgeting responsibly bullshit approach to life for three months." What would happen if you gave yourself three months every time you start to think about, "I feel stuck," just being like, "You know what? It's just three months of my life"? What if you did it for three months, and then you could see the cost benefit of spending less on things that you enjoy but not worrying about survival as much?

T:                    Yeah. That's what it is. It's like I push myself into a survival zone because I don't want to let go of the things that I want.

Jessica:            The indulgences.

T:                    Yeah.

Jessica:            And listen. You may find at the end of three months, "You know what? I might as well fucking have my indulgences and stress." That's cool. You might find at the end of three months, "Neither of these things are sustainable. I need my side hustle." But you won't know unless you try. And what you do know is that you've been doing the same thing over and over and over again, and it's not working.

T:                    Yeah.

Jessica:            So try something new. It's not about trying something new and sticking with it for the rest of your life. It's about trying something new and seeing what shifts, what you learn about yourself, what you learn about your resources. It might be that it's actually worth it to you to not worry about survival and to have less—this is the thing about your Venus in Taurus. You might be buying happy, right?

T:                    Yeah. Yeah.

Jessica:            You might not be, but you might be. And so working with that can be really expansive. It doesn't have to be a consequence and a limitation. And there's going to be no shortage of people who are going to complain with you about late-stage capitalism and the bullshit world we live in. And I will be one of them. And also, that's a separate issue. It's not a disconnected issue, but this is the issue of your birth chart that I would read whether or not we were in late-stage capitalism.

T:                    Right. Yeah. Yeah. That's really helpful to hear.

Jessica:            There's no amount of money that you're going to earn that's going to magically make you be like, "I know. I'll live within my means completely," because you're always going to be like, "But there are better cheeses." You know what I mean?

T:                    Yeah.

Jessica:            "There are beautiful charcoals," or whatever, right?

T:                    I'm just a guy who likes sushi. Sue me.

Jessica:            Honestly, I couldn't because I would like to eat the sushi with you. I love sushi. And of course, you want high-quality sushi; otherwise, why are you sushi-ing?

T:                    Yeah. You have to get good sushi. Otherwise, why are you buying sushi? Come on.

Jessica:            You know what? I mean, listen. You're talking to the wrong person if you want me to talk you out of spending money. And also, I would try it for three months.

T:                    Yeah. No, that's real. That's real.

Jessica:            Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

T:                    Yeah.

Jessica:            Totally. Totally.

T:                    And I have to do it because my new apartment is expensive, so I do have to do it. The pressure is on.

Jessica:            Having an apartment that is safe and secure and beautiful and life-affirming is worth it.

T:                    Yeah. It is.

Jessica:            And there might be times of your life where it's less worth it, but right now, it has to be very worth it.

T:                    Yeah. It is.

Jessica:            Good. All right. We damn did it.

T:                    We did it.

Jessica:            Woo. Will you please share photos of all the goats so that we can share it with the people?

T:                    Do you want to see baby pictures now? Because they're just so stinking cute, and you should see them.

Jessica:            Oh God. I'm so excited.

(pictures shown)

Jessica:      Oh my God.

T:                    Yeah. They're so sweet. That's Gwen on the right and Greta with her airplane ears on the left.

Jessica:            Wait a minute. Greta is so cute.

T:                    She's so cute. She's got little airplane ears. We love her so much.

Jessica:            Oh my God. Look at those eyes. Her eyes are, like, on top of her ears.

T:                    They are.

Jessica:            So cute.

T:                    Here are some babies.

Jessica:            Oh.

T:                    The babies—when they just come out, they're just so precious. They're just all legs.

Jessica:            Oh, so sweet.

T:                    They're just totally just delightful. Yeah. Here's the whole herd. A little hard to see them all, but that's Greta in the front and Gwen behind her. Then there's Olivia, Blue, and Ophelia in the back.

Jessica:            They're so cute.

T:                    They're so sweet. They're so precious to me. I love them so much.

Jessica:            They're so sweet.

T:                    And this was so helpful for us.

Jessica:            Oh, I'm so glad. I'm so glad.

T:                    Thank you so much for your time. This was really special.